Previa Alliance Podcast
There are few experiences as universal to human existence as pregnancy and childbirth, and yet its most difficult parts — perinatal mood and anxiety disorders (PMADs) — are still dealt with in the shadows, shrouded in stigma. The fact is 1 in 5 new and expecting birthing people will experience a PMAD, yet among those who do many are afraid to talk about it, some are not even aware they’re experiencing one, and others don’t know where to turn for help. The fact is, when someone suffers from a maternal mental health disorder it affects not only them, their babies, partners, and families - it impacts our communities.
In the Previa Alliance Podcast series, Sarah Parkhurst and Whitney Gay are giving air to a vastly untapped topic by creating a space for their guests — including survivors of PMADs and healthcare professionals in maternal mental health — to share their experiences and expertise openly. And in doing so, Sarah and Whitney make it easy to dig deep and get real about the facts of perinatal mental health, fostering discussions about the raw realities of motherhood. Not only will Previa Alliance Podcast listeners walk away from each episode with a sense of belonging, they’ll also be armed with evidence-based tools for healing, coping mechanisms, and the language to identify the signs and symptoms of PMADs — the necessary first steps in a path to treatment. The Previa Alliance Podcast series is intended for anyone considering pregnancy, currently pregnant, and postpartum as well as the families and communities who support them.
Sarah Parkhurst
Previa Alliance Podcast Co-host; Founder & CEO of Previa Alliance
A postpartum depression survivor and mom to two boys, Sarah is on a mission to destigmatize the experiences of perinatal mood and anxiety disorders (PMADs), and to educate the world on the complex reality of being a mom. Sarah has been working tirelessly to bring to light the experiences of women who have not only suffered a maternal mental health crisis but who have survived it and rebuilt their lives. By empowering women to share their own experiences, by sharing expert advice and trusted resources, and by advocating for health care providers and employers to provide support for these women and their families, Sarah believes as a society we can minimize the impact of the current maternal mental health crisis, while staving off future ones.
Whitney Gay
Previa Alliance Podcast Co-host; licensed clinician and therapist
For the past ten years, Whitney has been committed to helping women heal from the trauma of a postpartum mental health crisis as well as process the grief of a miscarriage or the loss of a baby. She believes that the power of compassion paired with developing critical coping skills helps moms to heal, rebuild, and eventually thrive. In the Previa Alliance Podcast series, Whitney not only shares her professional expertise, but also her own personal experiences of motherhood and recovery from grief.
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Previa Alliance Podcast
If We Were Pregnant Again This Is What We Would Do Differently
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Have you ever wondered how to navigate the emotional and physical roller coaster of pregnancy and postpartum life? Join Sarah and Whitney as they share lessons from their own journeys, revealing anxieties about taking medications, pressures from social media, setting clear hospital boundaries, and the importance of sleep. Balancing the joys and challenges of the postpartum period can be overwhelming, and we’re here to help you through it.
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Pregnancy Lessons for Future Moms
Speaker 1hey guys , welcome back to preview alliance podcast . This is sarah , and I am with whitney again , hey friends . And so , whitney , we have got asked this before . I'm sure you've been asked this if we were pregnant again , what would we do differently ?
Speaker 2It's a good question . I'm actually that rare person that enjoyed pregnancy . Aside from the first trimester nausea , food aversions Other than that , I actually enjoyed pregnancy . So , as much as my body would tolerate it , I would try to incorporate exercise , because I was able to sustain that longer in my second pregnancy versus my first , and I think that that just really did a lot for me overall . But that was also COVID times , so getting outside and walking was one of the few things that we could do in 2020 . And so I think it was just a good stress release , very grounding for me . So incorporating whatever type of exercise that you want to do while your body allows you to do it is a good stress release , very grounding for me . So incorporating whatever type of exercise that you want to do while your body allows you to do it is a good thing .
Speaker 1Yeah . Would there have been anything you wouldn't have thought that you did or stressed out about something that you did ?
Speaker 2I think I would . And it was so hard because I felt like such a hypocrite , because I worked in the hospital and I could say this to people , but it was so hard to accept it for myself is that it really is okay to take a Tylenol during your pregnancy ? Because one day I had this horrible migraine of a headache and I tried everything under the sun to get rid of it , like drinking a little bit of caffeine , eating a little bit to make sure my blood sugar was up , like doing all these different things and none of it worked . And you know , I worked in labor and delivery at that time and they were like Whitney , just take a Tylenol , You're allowed to have a Tylenol .
Speaker 2And I was so terrified it was going to harm my baby . And they were like no one , Tylenol is not going to hurt her . And of course I took a Tylenol . It relieved my headache , All was right with the world . But I wish , instead of feeling so guilty or stressed over that , I would have just known it really is okay to take a Tylenol . Yeah , Like you're allowed to do that and it is safe . It has been proven safe .
Speaker 1Yeah , that's interesting . I was thinking , if I do not have a uterus anymore Baby Jay took that , you know , through his , his delivery , I ended up having a hysterectomy . So no more babies for us , which we were okay with . I do think we talked about this on different episodes , but I think there was a part with something with anything if it , even if you want to be done when you don't have the choice of like , right , it's a grief , you know . But I think about the , if I say back , if I was for some reason that happened , to get pregnant again , I would have really . I think I just was like so wishful to feel better Cause I was really sick , right that I wasn't like in the moment with it , I was just you know like , and that's so hard to say and like who knows you know if that would have even been possible , but I would have .
Speaker 1I had a lot of anxiety and a lot of because I've had miscarriages of loss . So I wish I would have been like acknowledging that and had been working through that , because it was not fun to always think I was like I always thought the worst was going to happen and I was like fixated on that or I went into complete denial of it and didn't even really want to talk about my pregnancy . It was like a flip back and forth . So I think I would have really just been like , hey , during pregnancy , mental health is super hard too , and I wish I would have been open about it instead of thinking , well , it's going to get better , it's going to get better . So that's something I would have done differently , I agree . I definitely would have like walked more like as much in .
Speaker 1The people hear that and they're like I'm miserable and I get that . But like it always made me feel better and physically and mentally , and I was obsessive about like researching things too . Right , google is not your friend , no , so I wish I would have leaned more into asking other people who you know were a lot ahead of me , and be like , hey , what was helpful ? What did you actually use ? Because I didn't realize at the time and we've talked about this before but , like when you're pregnant and postpartum , like marketing and companies like they prey on you and like they want to say this is the best .
Speaker 1This is that you know , when you feel like this , I have to pick the right best and that , like you know , it's going to determine my worth as a mom . So I think I would have tried to tune out that noise a little bit and trusted my gut and my baby was going to be okay , no matter what brand of something I bought .
Speaker 2Right , absolutely .
Speaker 1I think that would have been huge If I had to do it again . I would have started looking for child care like the first month of pregnancy , because now , knowing what I know about child care , it is something that , like people put their names on wait lists for child care before they're even pregnant .
Speaker 2Yeah , it's wild . So I was pregnant with my first when we got her into her daycare and then , once I was through the first trimester , with my second , just because you know I had that ectopic scare . That's when I put her on the list for the daycare that my oldest already went to .
Speaker 1Okay , so I mean I would immediately that I would have asked instead of . You know I wouldn't have asked for that many clothing . I think even that , because the babies grow so fast and like even when you're looking at diapers , I would have like went back and be like I want multiple ranges . I'd like the newborns go so quickly .
Speaker 2He just made one bag of newborn and then they're going to go to size one or whatever . He just made one bag of newborn .
Speaker 1You just need one pack of it and then they're going to go to size one or whatever . And then you know my boy , like Will , was a preemie . So like we had nothing that fit him and just being aware , especially if you do see the NICU or early delivery of like it's kind of hard to find preemie clothes and diapers . So I had no clue about that and I would have started , which our preemie moms are very blessed to have Jenny create so much content for them . But you know , I wanted to breastfeed with Will for sure . I wish I would have learned how to breastfeed during pregnancy , not something that I thought I could just learn after C-section and us both slowly , you know , losing our minds . So I wish I would have started early .
Speaker 2Yes .
Speaker 1I thankfully had no choice but to deliver where I delivered , which was an academic university that had a top of the art NICU . But I now know from talking to a lot of women and I'm sure you know this , Whitney that where you deliver is very important to recognize if there is a NICU , so an ICU for the baby and what level . And I've had their stories . I've had a friend that , like when you don't know what's actually gonna happen at at delivery sometimes , and when the baby needed intensive care was separated from her and because they can take care of mom but they couldn't take care of baby , so baby was transferred to a different hospital , Right ? So I always tell people be aware of where you deliver . If you have options and choices , can they take care of you and baby ? Because I both incidences with Will and James was able to be rolled into the NICU to spend time with them or Will down . I was in the same place .
Speaker 2Right , yes , so research on hospitals is huge , and it could be one that you're committed to a hospital and not an OB , or you're committed to an OB , but the OB is committed to the hospital .
Speaker 1So you may have the rights .
Speaker 2You have to figure out what is more important to you your relationship that you have with your OB , or what that hospital provides and all of it depends on . Are you already high risk ? Do you know that you're high risk going into it ?
Speaker 1Yeah , which I was both times , and I tell people I said , do you know that you're high risk going into it ? Yeah , which I was both times . And I tell people I said you know now , after my experience ? Right , I just always say you know , I advise . If someone says , well , what would you advise me to do , I say I would advise to pick the hospital that can properly take care of you and baby , not to separate and that is you know . Even if you have a picture perfect pregnancy you would rather have than have not in that case . And then also things that I you know just tips and tricks along the way is , if you do want to breastfeed , calling your insurance . They will often provide a free breast pump . Go ahead and get that going before delivery . Knowing you know if you're working , knowing ahead of time what your maternity leave policy is , what your benefits are , go ahead and working with HR . If you do have a complication , you need FMLA , you need certain like working accommodations . Go ahead . And like learning , there's a lot of good resources on Instagram like the mom attorneys one . There's a lot of good resources on Instagram like the mama attorneys one . There's a lot of like birth lawyer education stuff you can learn about of what rights you have as a pregnant working woman that his employers will sometimes not know that you know the rules , right .
Speaker 1I would do that . I would ask for I always say this I'm like I would ask for DoorDash gift cards . I would ask for a fund for a night nurse . If I could Like , if there was like a doula or a night thing , I would say hey , especially my second one . I would have been like if my friends want to donate 10 bucks , 20 bucks , we pull the money . I use that for that . For sleep to me would have been the best gift , right ? It's part of absolutely so stuff like that . I wish I would have known . I would have really had a better mental health plan in the sense of prioritizing sleep . I would have said I have to at minimum get three to four hours of a stretch of sleep at night . I don't know how that looks like , but I need that .
Speaker 1I would have had like a meal training set up . I would have like freezer meals . I would have started . I had a friend . She was like you know , I cook double and I freeze one Right Spaghetti , casseroles , chicken and rice . Like you know . She was like if we had a little extra , make me a meal or make a kid's meal . Label it , freeze it Stuff like that of what . When you do feel like it , do it . I truly started to learn about maternal mental health early , knowing the signs and symptoms and being like super open with my friends and family early and saying your provider and my provider .
Speaker 1Hey , this is important to me , these are my risk factors Knowing the signs and symptoms , knowing what postpartum psychosis is , my family knowing what it is and us just being really comfortable with it . We were not comfortable with it , we weren't aware , and so when I was experiencing it and probably same with you , it just took longer than it should to get treatment .
Speaker 2Right .
Speaker 1I now you know people say it , I think it's annoying when they say it , but I'm going to say it Seasons of life , knowing that that newborn stage was going to be so hard and like your groundhog day every day and you just want sleep and your body's healing , but knowing like you will get to the other side of that and really you kind of got to go through it to know it because you don't believe it in the beginning . You're just like my baby's never going to sleep .
Speaker 2Well , because it never feels like you are going to sleep . Yeah right .
Speaker 1So just those things . You know we white noise saves . I'm a huge fan of white noise and I'm a huge fan of you know , sleep training is controversial , right ? People feel a certain way about it and don't , but I would say sleep is a vital point for your mental health and your baby's growth . There is so much free education out there that you can learn about ways of sleep , schedules and naps and like Wake windows all of the things .
Speaker 1All the things and you know you can go back and listen to our podcast with Yanadi Patel . That's the Rest of Sleep and we talk and you go into things knowing what a wake window is Like . I didn't know that . I was like , oh my gosh , a baby is only like awake for 60 minutes , then needs a nap . So if you're trying to keep that baby up longer than their wake window they cannot want to go to sleep the world will fall apart , the world will crash and burn , and that's literally how it feels .
Speaker 1And I remember people being like Sarah you're so rigid about their sleep schedules and I'm like the reason why I was so rigid is because I was so desperate for sleep , I was so desperate for like peace and just like a moment to myself and , yeah , I was not going to let anybody screw that up and I'm sorry we said no to a lot of things because it was nap time or bedtime and it was for protection of my own , like mental health and sanity .
Speaker 2Absolutely yes , as it should be .
Speaker 1I wish I would have like not cared so much what people said . Right , they got to tune a lot of it out .
Speaker 2I was about to say . That's a boundary thing . Coming from a people pleaser , you kind of have to not care what others are going to think about it . And with that can come those boundaries of what do you want hospital visitation to look like for you ? What do you want postpartum visitation to look like for you ? What do you feel down in your core is good for you and your family ? Yeah , you know , if I had to do it again COVID absent , because COVID was the bad guy for me with my second one , which did not hurt my feelings , it was not a bad thing , it was not .
Speaker 2I actually was very thankful
Setting Boundaries and Expectations Postpartum
Speaker 2for that . But I do remember after my first was born and again . But I do remember after my first was born , and again not a traumatic delivery , nothing bad happened . But I started laboring with her at two thirty in the morning . She was born at eleven forty one .
Speaker 2We did not stop having visitors until eight thirty that night . So from about two in the afternoon until eight thirty at night we had visitors , and then you got to think I had been up since 2 am and visitors didn't leave till 830 . And we're doing every three hour feeds , like I was exhausted . So I wish I had known with my first pregnancy no visitors day of delivery . I wish I had thought of that . I really wish I had thought of that . I really wish I had thought of that and I didn't . And I remember telling my husband at the hospital then I said if we ever do this again , I do not want visitor's day of delivery . Yeah , I don't . And then you know , covid happened . So COVID was the bad guy , which was fine by me . That didn't hurt my feelings . It was actually quite nice just to have that time with her , just to bond and just to be chill and not feel like I had to entertain and be up and about and all the things .
Speaker 1We would suggest that you guys have these conversations with get on the same page with your partner and then get on the same page . You know they can get on their same page with their side and you get on your side and just set those boundaries because you need to have that conversation . Begin a third trimester , start having it , if not earlier , and tell these people hey , this is what we have decided , because do not assume that they , like people , assume the most crazy things they do . It's wild . So don't give them room for assumptions . Just set that hey , I'm so excited for you to meet her , but we're not doing visitors in the hospital and like I need a week home to get settled . I will reach out to you and we'll get a date in time . Blah , blah , blah . Or like the last thing you want , which has happened to a lot of people , is you know you've got one boob out , you're still bleeding , you're crying and here comes in someone and you're just like really .
Speaker 2Really , and then you get painted as the bad guy when this is like the most vulnerable bonding time and you just went through birth like hello , you're exhausted and well and the fun massages that we have to have things like that , like I do not need my family in there when the nurse is checking my bleeding and pushing on my stomach no , and that hurts , I heard I did not enjoy those at all .
Speaker 1And then I just even remember , like the hospital gown , like , and my dad my dad is the , you know my dad was there and my mom was there and I was glad , but it was even like getting up in the hospital gown in front of my dad , I was just like , oh , you know , like cause you know you've got these like granny panties on and this big old pad , and I needed help getting up to the bathrooms postpartum , especially with C-section , and I was just like this is like I don't know it tried to breastfeed . I was super , just like . Now , you know , the second time around I was just like I don't care , you know , but the first time I was super , just like , insecure about it . And the door is a revolving door . In the hospital Preview , Mom Jenny has a really great video called the worst hotel experience ever , talking about hospital stay .
Speaker 1You guys should check that out . But you're getting constant interruptions anyways and you just like I don't want to see somebody else , no , so have those hard conversations . I think I never had an option really of like how do I want my birth plan to go ? So I was always just known it had to be C-sections both times . But if you go into it and you have options , just be very clear and I would say be flexible and have like don't get set on . It has to be this way .
Speaker 1In your head go ahead and say okay , if this is option A , we're going to do everything we can , but if option B happens , these are still things that are important to me .
Speaker 2Right , yes , have your backup plans in place .
Speaker 1I'm sure you hear clients who are really grieving the loss of a birth experience that they wanted .
Speaker 2Oh , that happens frequently and not getting the golden hour with their baby . Yeah , that's a big one .
Speaker 1I didn't get that with either of my boys and it really does , and people talk about that and it's not like if you're pregnant now you're like , oh great , you know that could happen . But I think just being aware of if it does become medically urgent and things need to happen , I think just knowing kind of like hey , no one told me before the hand like you're not going to see Will for X amount of time because we got to get him situated and you situated . So I had no expectations Right , except for my own , which were wrong .
Speaker 2Got to throw that part in .
Speaker 1Yeah , I mean , I had my own , because we all do right , we all go into it and we have in our head what we think is going to happen and should happen Right . Go into it and we have in our head what we think is going to happen and should happen right . And when it doesn't and you don't even know , if it doesn't happen , which ways it could go then I think everybody's just left in the dark right , yep , and it's a guessing game .
Speaker 2And then those unspoken expectations are missed . So then bitterness and resentment can build up , and it can , just it can go south quickly yeah I would advise .
Speaker 1I mean , people may disagree with me with this , but I think you got to be really careful with social media in the immediate postpartum period yeah , I think you can quickly go down a rabbit hole if everybody has got it together more than you or is a better mom or what you should be doing or looking like real quickly . So I think if you have any kind of background of struggling with a little bit of comparison or doom scrolling or numbing with social media , Right , it's easy .
Speaker 1I would limit that if you're feeling as best as you could in that postpartum period , right ? If you realize , hey , it's not being healthy for me , it's not benefiting me , it's not making me feel better , it's actually making me feel worse . You know , it can be used in a situation where you're like oh that you know . She's saying this is hard and she's crying too . Okay , yeah .
Speaker 2Yeah , If it gives you a sense of community and camaraderie , that is okay . But if it starts to build up that comparison trap that's when we got to get rid of it If it makes you have intrusive thoughts , if it skyrockets your depression or anxiety or OCD , then you know what it's got to go .
Speaker 1Yeah , and you know I recently stopped Instagram , for you know I was aligned with a 21 days of prayer in January and I just recently , you know , started back slowly and I mean honest , I actually really loved not being on it on social media .
Speaker 2Right , it was nice . It's a good break .
Mental Health Tips for Expecting Moms
Speaker 1So I think when you're really under sleep deprivation , I would understand sleep deprivation . That is something I would say during pregnancy , which you're going to learn about that in the third trimester , unfortunately , because no one sleeps well at the end of the pregnancy . But I would understand how sleep deprivation makes depression worse , makes you have rage , how it may feel hard to concentrate . You can just feel like you can't process . I would really stress like understand what lack of sleep will do to your body and mind .
Speaker 2Absolutely that . It's a detriment .
Speaker 1And what things look like . I love . Do you remember mommy labor nurse ? She told us that she sets a reminder to check in on her postpartum friends .
Speaker 1I think she said four months , was she three or four months ? But I think if you're listening to this you're like , oh , my best friend's pregnant , or so . So you know , my sister , my daughter , set that timer to alert , you know . Or my sister , my daughter , set that timer Right To alert to say , check in . And I would say how you could , what I would for my pregnant friends . Now it's just how to have a conversation with them about how they really are .
Speaker 2Right , well , and let's throw in our friends that experience miscarriages and child loss as well . Yep , throw in our friends that experience miscarriages and child loss as well . Yep , because once the service is over if there's a service , because with miscarriage that doesn't happen often , you know once kind of the dust settles , so to speak , people go on about their lives and that mom feels very forgotten and lonely . So having that check-in , I would say even a month after loss , is a big deal .
Speaker 1Oh , a hundred percent , and say , thinking of you , I'm here for you , you don't have to fix their loss . I think that's a big misconception , is like I have to say the right thing to fix it or make them not feel a certain way , or I don't want to bring up the elephant in the room . Well , they're already thinking about the elephant in the room . It's just someone just recognizing that life and like your grief right and that that's all it takes , and it's a journey .
Speaker 1Pregnancy's a journey , and even to the point of like I bought a lot of things I really didn't need , and there's good , there was bad , there was , you know . I'll tell myself this I peed on myself and I thought my water broke .
Speaker 2Yep , it happens .
Speaker 3I was mortified .
Speaker 1Whitney , mortified , went to the pregnancy ER and I was like in , the new resident I'll never forget , god love his soul . Came in . He said , okay , I'm going to evaluate , never forget . He , god love his soul . Came in . He said , okay , I'm gonna evaluate . And like they swab , you know , to test if , like , there's like amni fluid or what or what . And he came back and he and he did an exam , and that was not a comfortable exam , by the way , and he was like ma'am , I hate to tell you this , but that was just urine . And I was just like , oh , so you're just telling me ? I just peed on myself and I came in here thinking my water broke .
Speaker 1He said , said , oh , you're not , you're not the only one , it happens frequently . And I was like it does all the time , thank you for that . And packed my little self up and waddled out of there and I was like , love this for me . I love this for me . Because I had called my parents like get in the car , like love this for me . Because I had called my parents like get in the car . Like six , we had asked our dear friends to come over to watch Will . I had paged Bill , he was in surgery . He wasn't answering . I had one of his residents come get him and say Sarah said labor and I went back and told everybody Sarah just beat on herself .
Speaker 2Oh baby , james , been giving you a run for your money for a minute .
Speaker 1He's humbled me from the start , but he still does . But , guys , this I think key takeaways will be to please learn and educate about your mental health early first trimester . Go back . We have two specific episodes what is depression during pregnancy ? What does anxiety during pregnancy look like ? Those are fabulous and we have a whole series . What is postpartum depression , anxiety , ptsd , ocd and psychosis ? So simply listening and sharing that is a great . You're going to do more than the majority of people do .
Speaker 2Absolutely Figure out your boundaries for the hospital people do Absolutely .
Speaker 1Figure out your boundaries for the hospital . Uh-huh , tune out the noise . Yes , yep , tune out the noise . Realize that the marketing , the consumer market that is , baby products , is coming at you . So I always say tried and true is always if you can get another mom to say what really worked , what didn't work . Take things for a grain of salt . What brand you buy is not going to determine if your baby walks by 10 months or reading by two . You know , don't buy it . The thing we have learned as well is sleep . Please prioritize your sleep . Please set yourself up for success in postpartum . Start having those conversations . How can I have food ? How can I have sleep ? How can I get childcare early ? Please look at something I've learned recently is there is different hospitals , that viability ?
Speaker 1of the baby , of where they will try to save the baby in the sense of medical interventions , as if they will intubate , if they'll do CPR , and you may be like I don't even want to think about that .
Speaker 2Well , it's not a place . Let's just figure out who can meet that need if it arises .
Speaker 1Let's just figure out who can meet that need if it arises . And have that because I have met with families that if they would have delivered at a hospital across the street or across town , things would have been different .
Speaker 1And if I will say , if breastfeeding is important to you , start learning about lactation and how to breastfeed during pregnancy . Do not wait until that baby is there . I say learn about formula , even if you plan to solely breastfeed , because that is something that you don't want to be going to the store at 3am trying to figure it out . Been there , done that and then , finally , I would say for sure , know your risk factors and always have a good therapist to have open conversations with your OB and your family . And you do , you do your pregnancy .
Speaker 2Absolutely .
Speaker 1Yes .
Speaker 2You do you .
Speaker 1This is your pregnancy , this is your body . Trust your gut , speak up and we're cheering for you and we'll be with you through pregnancy and postpartum . Absolutely All right , guys . Till next time .
Speaker 3Have a great week , see ya , Maternal mental health is as important as physical health . The Preview Alliance podcast was created for and by moms dealing with postpartum depression and all its variables , like anxiety , anger and even apathy . Hosted by CEO founder Sarah Parkhurst and licensed clinical social worker Whitney Gay , each episode focuses on specific issues relevant to pregnancy and postpartum . Join us and hear how other moms have overcome mental health challenges , as well as access tips and suggestions on dealing with your own challenges as moms . You can also browse our podcast library and listen to previous episodes at any time . Please know you're not alone on this journey . We're here to help .