Speaker 1 0:01

Hey guys, welcome back to Preview Alliance podcast. This is Sarah and we are in our holiday season. This season, whitney and I decided to do replay episodes because these are some of our most listened to episodes and so vital to equip and empower you guys through the stressful holiday season. So, no matter where you are at in life, these episodes are made for you, to help guide you, to support you and know you're not alone. So hang in there. We're are made for you to help guide you, to support you and know you're not alone. So hang in there, we're right there with you. Stay tuned. Hey guys, welcome back to Preview Alliance podcast. This is Sarah and Whitney. We are in Thanksgiving and you know we're thankful. We're grateful. Infertility, just because it's the holiday season, doesn't we're eating turkey, we're stuffing ourselves, does not mean anything that we're going through, just stops.

Speaker 2 1:30

Exactly, it actually gets harder. Oh, a thousand percent. Especially I mean from personal experience grief gets harder with holidays.

Speaker 1 1:37

It does, and maybe even it's that thing that you're going through. That. You've kind of just been like, okay, if I can get through the holidays, then I'm okay. Then I'm okay. Or I'm distracted by you know, we're looking up our recipes, we're talking to family, we're getting in the spirit, but then it comes up. You're like huh, so let's talk through a couple of scenarios. So to the new mom so she's sleep deprived, she's healing, she's adjusting. You've got new family dynamics and you're she's simply trying to keep her head above water, right, she's surviving right now so now we're expecting her to go into a very busy season.

Speaker 1 2:21

Yeah, like nothing has happened, like nothing's happened, she's not impacted, but her whole world's just been right, flipped up and you know it again. It goes back to like she's not sleeping and healing. And so if that new mom is listening, you're like I don't want to go to 15 events this season I don't want to do that and I'm not newly postpartum, exactly. They don't right.

Speaker 1 2:45

Like you could take this time and say I'm so thankful that I have this baby and I'm going to do what I need to do right now for us, and we'll catch you guys next year.

Speaker 2 2:56

Correct. Yeah, or hot take, hot take. Yeah, Maybe family can go to her and bring her some things. Yes, see if she needs a nap or a shower, and then they're gone in an hour hour and a half.

Speaker 1 3:07

And don't ask her to host, and if you think you should host.

Speaker 2 3:11

No, no, no.

Speaker 1 3:11

Okay, I'm going to tell you, don't put that on you. No no, let's not do that Okay.

Speaker 2 3:20

Make your life easy. It's fine, I would say Chick-fil-A, but I know they're closed, yeah, yeah.

Speaker 1 3:25

Go to the pizza place. Go to pizza or Chinese.

Speaker 2 3:27

They're always open.

Speaker 1 3:28

Exactly, mom with small kids. Okay, so you're in these young years which I'm with you, whitney slowly is escaping a little bit, those toddler years, you've almost made it with one and but we're still very much. We're in the trenches, exhausted, mentally, physically. You're making this magic, you're carrying the mental heavy load. You put a lot of expectations onto yourself, yeah, and your kids are not gonna not need things or break things or your kids don't realize what everybody else has Exactly.

Speaker 2 4:08

So they don't feel that same pressure to do all the things that you're putting on yourself. They, I'm assuming, don't have social media.

Speaker 1 4:16

No.

Speaker 2 4:16

So they don't have to see all of these things, right? So realize that your kids don't have that expectation of you. So take that expectation off of yourself.

Speaker 1 4:28

Exactly the mom who's navigating loss. Now you guys know Whitney's been very open about her losses that she experienced and just kind of talk a little bit about how that was with holidays.

Speaker 2 4:43

It was honestly a little surreal. Yeah, because my mom's dad died in October, so you immediately had Halloween right there. I want you to know, a lot of people are like that's not a holiday, but it's one of those, like, we actually really enjoyed that growing up. So it's like, okay, this is different. Yeah. But then in November, the week before Thanksgiving, my father-in-law passed away and so that was just a very surreal. Okay, because my mom's dad we always did Thanksgiving at his house, right, right, so that was totally new to not go to his house. Well then I also had my father-in-law where we didn't get together with them. And then in December, like unexpectedly, my other grandfather died three days before Christmas.

Speaker 2 5:28

So come Christmas and New Year's, it was like, oh, we're down, three people on three different sides of the family, yeah, this is weird. And so you almost expect that person to come through the door. Now, from a mom losing a child perspective, you don't expect them to walk through the door. You don't necessarily have like a personality trait or a behavior that they routinely had, but you expected to carry them in in their car seat. You expected to be able to have that family picture in front of the Christmas tree, you expect it to be able to do a stocking for them A stocking still kind of killed me a little bit because I think I'm supposed to have two more than I do.

Speaker 1 6:14

Yeah, Still, I'm many years removed. Yep, I think again. Loss and grief. And grief can even be from trauma. Yes, If not, a lot of people experience it right.

Speaker 2 6:28

And grief can come from divorce.

Speaker 1 6:30

Divorce it could be. You know, now that we're parents, we're navigating relationships with our family and our friends and sometimes those relationships end because we're setting healthy boundaries for ourselves and our children, so that could be that loss.

Speaker 2 6:45

Absolutely.

Speaker 1 6:46

And then to the mom who wants to be a mom. Yeah, and it's not happening.

Speaker 2 6:52

Been there. You know, that's really a hard place to be.

Speaker 1 6:56

The holidays are really hard because everybody I do it, you know I'm guilty you post the cute family photos. If it's the turkey, you know, the baby's in a little turkey, something little turkey hat or you know family members that we haven't seen forever. They're questioning hey, Whitney, when are you having a?

Speaker 2 7:15

baby, or you see everybody else's little ones and you keep thinking I should have my baby here too, and it's just, it's like salt to the wound.

Navigating Trauma and Toxic Positivity

Speaker 2 7:25

You're already grieving and mourning and then seeing that as just another layer of that, and so it's one of those you may dread going to family functions, and you didn't use to dread that. So in comes another aspect of grief, or it may be one of those. You go into that event excited and ready to see family, and then the reality of I don't have my baby with me, whether it be from infertility, miscarriage or child loss, and all of a sudden you leave there and you're like, well, that kind of deflated me.

Speaker 2 7:59

That wasn't what I hoped it would be.

Speaker 1 8:02

I've been very open. I avoided holidays post miscarriage. Yeah, I did. I couldn't do it and it was good for my mental health and I don't think people understood, but that's okay, yeah. And then on the topic of mental health, the mom's struggling mentally. So if you are suffering from a maternal mental health condition postpartum depression, pregnancy depression, anxiety, OCD, PTSD this doesn't magically make it go away.

Speaker 2 8:35

If it did, I wouldn't have a job.

Speaker 1 8:37

That's true. And Whitney, when are you? Very busy, holidays.

Speaker 2 8:40

Yeah, it's weird because we have a big buildup to the holidays. Then I will say we kind of have a lull between Christmas and like the week after New Year's which I get it Everybody's busy, Everybody's going and doing and all those kinds of things.

Speaker 1 8:53

And then they all pile in after oh yeah.

Speaker 2 8:55

I'd say mid-January. You really see that uptick, come on, because they want everybody to talk about it. Oh yeah, everyone has to kind of process all the things from the holidays. I mean same for me because, again, I had already been seeing my therapist, knowing that my father-in-law and my grandfather were in hospice care and I had remembered talking to her.

Speaker 2 9:15

We're gonna say early December give or take a little bit after my father in law died and then, when my other grandfather died, I was able to see her I think it was the week of New Year's, it wasn't the week of Christmas and she was like what has happened?

Speaker 2 9:29

And I said you're not going to believe what I have to tell you. So yeah, even as a therapist going to see my therapist, I can tell you believe what I have to tell you. So even as a therapist going to see my therapist, I can tell you there are things that we have to bring to the table to process, because we never know what's going to happen at the holidays, even if somebody doesn't say anything to us. That's hurtful.

Speaker 1 9:46

There could be a trigger.

Speaker 2 9:48

Like, let's just say you're Aunt Brenda and Aunt Brenda behaves herself.

Speaker 1 9:52

She's okay, she's too busy eating.

Speaker 2 9:54

Yes, she behaved herself. She behaved herself Good's okay. She's too busy eating. Yes, she behaved herself Okay. She behaved herself Good for her. She's been listening and, yes, she's taken some notes. So Aunt Brenda behaves herself and Brenda doesn't say anything to me. That upsets me or hurts me. Nobody says anything. There's not an event.

Speaker 1 10:09

Okay, so it's a good family gathering.

Speaker 2 10:11

It's a good family gathering. It's a good family gathering, no events no drama, no, nothing. But I still walk away thinking man, I'm really sad that I don't have my baby with me, man, I'm really sad that I'm on year five of infertility and they're telling me that nothing can be done.

Speaker 1 10:28

I really miss my mom?

Speaker 2 10:29

Yeah, I miss my mom, or you know? Let's just say someone has gone through adoption process and it has been brick wall after brick wall and they just don't feel like they can even talk about it with family anymore because it's too sensitive.

Speaker 1 10:43

What's if your kid's in the hospital?

Speaker 2 10:45

What's if?

Speaker 1 10:45

it's a chronic, you know chronic medical child. What's if it's NICU? Right, you know.

Speaker 2 10:51

What if your baby was supposed to be born in January, but they came in October?

Speaker 1 10:54

Yeah, and so this is your Thanksgiving, this is your holidays, and people are like, oh, are you coming? And then you feel like I can't come because my baby's here. Am I wrong if I do this and wrong if I do that?

Speaker 2 11:08

You don't feel like you can win.

Speaker 1 11:09

Again, it goes back to whatever we're experiencing in life does not magically stop for a holiday. It doesn't.

Speaker 2 11:17

So in this and the holidays, don't erase it.

Speaker 1 11:19

No, they don't. They often highlight it and what we constantly hear is I am grateful, but like, I'm also being met with toxic positivity. So let's break down this difference here, okay. So if I'm showing gratitude, yes, that's authentic, right.

Speaker 2 11:40

Well, gratitude is something where we can say I am genuinely grateful for X, y and Z in my life Right. I'm very thankful for that. Toxic positivity is a way of gaslighting where it says oh, it'll get better as time goes on. Time heals all wounds.

Speaker 1 11:59

Right.

Speaker 2 11:59

That being said, does grief somehow get slightly easier with time? It does, because we learn to adapt, but time does not heal all wounds.

Speaker 1 12:08

No, it does not.

Speaker 2 12:09

And so that's a toxic positivity People just saying, oh, you'll be fine, just have a drink or just smile through it. Fake it till you. Make it Things like that. No, just no it doesn't work.

Speaker 1 12:24

It just ignores reality, and you know reality is reality, right, and toxic positivity is not where you know. I think a good example is what I received when I had a miscarriage. Now here's examples of things that people literally said to me Okay, everything happens for a reason. I hate that. Just keep thinking positive. My loss was worse, I had it at this. Or if so-and-so's loss was worse, you should be grateful you could get pregnant. That shows you could get pregnant, not I wish I was kidding. At least it happened early. Smile, it will help. So those types of toxic positivity made me feel shameful to say I am hurt, I'm devastated, I am lost.

Speaker 2 13:23

But you're making me think, like you're forcing me to find the silver light, and sometimes there's not a silver light. Yeah, sometimes there's not, and it's okay that we say that we're calling a spade a spade. No one is ever going to be happy that they experienced a miscarriage or a child loss or anything of that nature.

Speaker 1 13:37

Or a failed adoption, or my child's in the hospital, or I lost my job, or my husband's deployed during the holidays. Right, like I don't need you to tell me to smile more.

Speaker 2 13:52

Yeah, or just relax, it'll get better. Oh my gosh, that was a big one when we were going through infertility was just relax, don't stress out.

Speaker 1 14:00

Don't think about it.

Speaker 2 14:01

Well, I'm sorry. How can I not think about it? How can I not think about it?

Speaker 1 14:04

every month. When I got my period, it reminded me literally that I was not pregnant. Yeah, I get it. I think sometimes we're toxic, positive to ourself.

Speaker 2 14:14

Oh yeah, we can self gaslight, for sure, because I think part of that is a defense mechanism. We're trying to pull ourselves out of it because our feelings are not enjoyable, right, they're not pleasant, and we don't really want to sit with those emotions. And so we keep saying, okay, well, if I just distract myself or if I just don't think about it, it won't be so bad. Well, there's a time and a place for us to compartmentalize. Sure, absolutely. Did I compartmentalize when I was doing sessions with people after getting bad phone calls? Yes, because it's not appropriate for me to break down and sob in front of my clients.

Speaker 2 14:49

But at the same time I have to allow myself an opportunity to feel those things and to grieve those things and realize that it's normal for me to feel that and I swear if I had one more person tell me well, at least they're in a better place and they're not suffering. I thought I was going to throat punch them which is not a therapist not recommending but felt that was going to throat punch them, uh huh, yep, which is not a not therapist, not recommending, but felt that way.

Speaker 1 15:14

So, just being honest, it's just authentic and you're just, you're real, like yeah, you don't need to hear that.

Speaker 2 15:18

Like yes, I'm well aware that my grandfather and father in law are no longer in hospice care and I can be thankful that they're not hurting, but at the same time, I still miss them so bad. Like. And also, how bad is it to have to lose that many people that close together? Like? We're allowed to say man, I got dealt some bad cards then, man, this is hard, that's not an enjoyable thing.

Speaker 1 15:40

You are okay, you can say it, oh yeah, say this is hard, say I am feeling X, that I wish this was different. I'm still mad that what I pictured this holiday to be, because if you are just always keeping that inside and I think it goes back to our inner child, where we were never allowed to express emotions- yeah, say what we needed to say.

Speaker 2 16:06

We need to shove it in.

Speaker 1 16:07

We need to. You know the good girls, the good, you know, who didn't make trouble.

Speaker 2 16:12

Yeah.

Speaker 1 16:13

How's that working out for us now? Us people pleasers, uh-huh, us people pleasers.

Speaker 1 16:18

In serving professions. Uh-huh, just saying Hello us. So that's what's so hard too, is generational traits. Yeah, we're breaking, trying, we're breaking, trying, we're trying and we're trying to allow our kids to feel emotions. We're teaching boundaries. We're talking about our mental health. Okay, you know, aunt Brenda never spoke about it. That's why she shaves us when we talk about it. Right, you know, we go to therapy. We say, well, we're okay, we're not. And again, the holidays you're putting a bunch of family dynamics, you're putting a lots of emotions and it's okay to not be okay. And guess what it will pass. It's a season, it is, we know that. You know Christmas and Hanukkah is right ahead of us.

Speaker 1 17:06

Yep, well, can we also talk about, like the sensory overload and the schedule overload that comes to that season, on top of the difficulty and our kids are out of school, our schedules are off, we're eating more sugar, we're drinking probably more than we normally do, and we're hearing, you know, the music, the smells, everything, the demands of the season. It's like you know, thanksgiving hits and I feel like every mom's eternal clock just goes off and you just run and then we're sleep deprived because we're up having to do all the things.

Speaker 2 17:38

Yeah, so again.

Speaker 1 17:41

We want you to enjoy this holiday season, but if you need to step outside and go oh my gosh, that was hard, I'm upset you need to voice journal, you need to ground yourself, take a minute, you need to do a self-care day, maybe go to the rage room. Hey, we've been there. It works great.

Speaker 2 17:59

I'm just saying.

Speaker 1 18:00

Rage rooms. And guess what, if you've got trash, you can usually call them and say I've got like this old whatever. Can I bring it to smash it? They'll let you Really, yes, call ahead. They do here in Birmingham. They're great. I didn't know. I know from experience. But the moral story is, if the holidays are hard, you're not alone in it. Correct, we're filling it with you. We will be sending texts to each other back and forth, going you know what? I'm over it and it's day one and that's okay. So any other tips you can think of that you tell your clients for this season that we haven't covered.

Speaker 2 18:38

Especially moms, like if you have to go run an errand and you're lucky enough to get to leave the kiddos home with somebody else, you can take an extra five minutes in the driveway to decompress.

Speaker 1 18:48

You can sit in that parking lot for a good five, ten minutes before you go to the store.

Speaker 2 18:51

Maybe traffic was really bad, I don't know.

Speaker 1 18:53

Take that moment. If anybody says self-care is not sitting alone in your car without your kids in it, you can listen to us, you can listen to music. You can sit in silence Sometimes we just sit in silence.

Speaker 2 19:03

Well, do you remember? That time I did send you a picture from my driveway and I was like I got back from the pharmacy and I don't know that I want to go inside again yet.

Maternal Mental Health and Support

Speaker 1 19:10

That's okay, yeah. Sometimes we need parking lot therapy. Yes, meditation, recommended by our favorite therapist here. I've done it myself. So if you need that permission, moms, do it. So again you're not alone. We're here through you. For this season We've got some really good episodes coming up, and you know we're going to do something a little different this year too. If you're going to hear from some of our favorite guests coming back and just sharing you know their experience, because sometimes you just again need to hear yeah, other moms are feeling what you're feeling.

Speaker 2 19:41

You're not alone in this.

Speaker 1 19:43

Okay, guys, till next time, See ya. Maternal mental health is as important as physical health. The premium alliance podcast was created for and by moms dealing with postpartum depression and all its variables, like anxiety, anger and even apathy. Hosted by ceo founder sarah parkhurst and licensed clinical social worker whitney gay, each episode focused on specific issues relevant to pregnancy and postpartum. Join us and hear how other moms have overcome mental health challenges, as well as access tips and suggestions on dealing with your own challenges as moms. You can also browse our podcast library and listen to previous episodes at any time. Please know you're not alone on this journey. We're here to help.