Speaker 1: 0:10

hey guys, welcome back to preview alliance podcast. This is sarah and I'm with whitney and we are in our thought series whitney. We last week covered the first set of thoughts and for, if you're tuning in listeners and you're what are she even talking about? We are talking about Dr David Burns, the Feeling Good Handbook, the 10 Most Common Cognitive Distortions, which we learned last week. But we'll catch you up to this week that those are thought patterns or thought ways that are going back to that root word distorted.

Speaker 1: 0:45

Distorted, so not necessarily the way we want you to be thinking, and it is something that you're doing intentionally, but your brain has this way of twisting things around.

Speaker 1: 0:52

So we were called out last week. I bet we'll probably be called out this week, which is fine, but the first one that we're going to go to which, I think, as moms, I think, as you know doing what we do and you know, being in a space, we can jump to conclusions, oh yeah, and the jumping to conclusions can come in different forms. Right, it could be that someone's late so they've gotten a rap and you know they've died. Or it could be I haven't heard back from someone so they're mad at me, or I've done something to offend them. Or it could even be like you know you go somewhere, like you're in your group party, you know your kids have a zillion things. Go to class party, you do something, you see another group of parents and you assume that they're judging you or based on something you've done, but you quickly jump to something that is really kind of unfounded, right, but your mind keeps you going down that road, right.

Speaker 3: 2:00

Yep. So it really sounds a lot like intrusive thoughts and worst case scenario thinking too. Yeah, especially if we're looking at the newly postpartum mom. Again, we've got sleep deprivation going on, we've got this rapid and significant change in hormones, so that's going to kind of make things worse. So that's going to kind of make things worse. But also, motherhood can be isolating. So when we look at that example of they didn't text me back or they didn't call me back or you know things like that, we think, well, they just don't want to be with me because of the baby. And then some resentment can start in motherhood because we have ruined my life by doing this, because we think I've ruined my life by doing this, when really maybe that person got tied up at work, their kid got sick, they read it, they thought they responded and they didn't hit send.

Speaker 3: 2:54

I mean all kinds of very minor surface level reasons for that. But also it makes me wonder about this person's like self-worth, like, maybe they're not worthy of that reciprocating.

Speaker 1: 3:08

Or it's like I don't even want to be around myself Right, or she doesn't. Either. Right, or I don't see myself as worthy, like you said, or you know, and so you have to challenge yourself. It's like, okay, you could fit into this box and many different ways of jumping to the conclusion right, is it? Everything's going great, you're sleeping, you've got the handle on life and you're still jumping. Then we need to talk through that. Or is it like you've had a?

Speaker 1: 3:36

you have a really hard go with it right and from any which way path you are on motherhood. But I think one thing most people forget about I do myself is the majority of time other people are so caught up in what they're going through, and everybody is going through something.

Speaker 1: 3:57

There is not one person that I know that does not have a challenge going on, and just because you don't see it, you haven't heard about it. There's a lot of things at play. So assumptions about people, as the saying goes, can make an ass out of you and me, right? So try not to assume, right, because, again, majority of people have good intentions and it's just about what they're like. You know, I know there's probably a couple of text messages now that I need to reply to, or emails from this week that I have thought about full intention.

Speaker 1: 4:36

It's just things have popped up and I try to mind myself because then, when I'm on the other end of that, yep, I have to say you know, sarah, remember you have this person in the inbox and that person you text back and you those. Because then, when I'm on the other end of that, I have to say you know, sarah, remember you have this person in the inbox and that person you text back and those people are important to you Absolutely. It's life. So I think that is different levels of jumping to conclusion. And if you always assume the worst case scenario, always assume it's going to end up like ER, they've wrecked, that is definitely something we want you to start talking to someone about, because that level of anxiety and fear and like intrusive thoughts that is going to come into play, especially in motherhood, that you're going to feel like a prisoner in your own mind.

Speaker 3: 5:23

Well, and oftentimes when we think about someone who has severe worst case scenario, thinking like they've died in a car accident because they're three minutes late, you know. That makes me wonder if there's a trauma source or a trauma root. Have they lived a worst case scenario? So now, worst case scenario is the automatic assumption worst case scenario.

Speaker 1: 5:47

So now, worst case scenario is the automatic assumption, and that is something I can say. I felt during all my pregnancies and all my deliveries. And I did remember this one physician they asked me. They said, well, why would you assume worst case, Sarah? Because I pretty much said, hey, I'm pretty sure this is what I'm dealing with here and it was like, well, that would be worst case scenario. Why would you assume that? And I said because the worst case has always happened to me, and from the miscarriages to the traumatic birth. So you're spot on, as normal, Whitney is like you, my brain was, neurons were like well, it happens every time.

Speaker 3: 6:19

Geared or accustomed to it.

Speaker 1: 6:21

It just felt like natural to assume that, and I just now and still am working through assuming which that was pregnancy involved. So now that I'm through that stage of life, I haven't seen that as much in my thinking, but it definitely was just almost like status quo to me. So, very oddly and I think relationships can be like that too right, if you've always been cheated on or abused or, you know, just treated this way your whole life from different relationships, then that is almost what you expect and you react to.

Speaker 3: 6:59

Yep Absolutely, absolutely.

Speaker 1: 7:02

That is a very important thing. That, again should be worked through with a counselor or a therapist. Now the next one magnification and minimization. It's similar to what we've kind of talked about in the past episode too, but I think an interesting thought of this one is so big moms do this right, like going on a beach trip. We're doing that, we're going somewhere, we're packing up for the weekend. Okay, we've literally done everything, we've arranged everything, we've packed all the things, we've made the reservations, but we forget one thing yep, and all you can see is I can't even do that right, or I'm a failure and you really really I have ruined vacation because I forgot one pair of flip flops.

Speaker 3: 7:55

I really take it the green ones and not the blue ones.

Speaker 1: 7:57

Uh-huh, and of course that's the one your kid's going to want and you're going to hear about it.

Speaker 1: 8:01

But it really is taking that magnifying glass onto that one thing and you're going to hear about it, but it really is taking that magnifying glass onto that one thing and you're minimizing, you're just really pulling back and you're missing all the things which we again go into mental load right that if we don't see sometimes a task that we're physically doing, we discount the mental things that we're doing. That is super heavy and reality is we have high superwoman expectations on ourselves.

Speaker 3: 8:30

Oh, absolutely Well, and I think social media in society really pushes this super mom, pinterest mom, bounce back culture where we're supposed to be able to do it all without a hiccup, and that is actually what we call high functioning anxiety. Yes, you know, I sent you that meme or that graphic the other day and I was like, oh look, it's me. And it talked about someone who is punctual, someone who is always put together, someone who tries to be well-spoken. They're viewed as a team leader, as a hard worker, like we see all of this on the outward shell of it, but on the inside you have someone that's like well, I can't be late, because then that's going to let everybody down.

Speaker 3: 9:10

And if I'm not put together, then I don't represent myself in my job very well. But if I don't stay on top of my projects, well then I'm going to get fired. And then how am I going to keep a roof over my kid's head? Like, we have that side for the high functioning anxiety, so to have this like magnifying glass on, we have to be able to do all the things all the time for all the people. Number one is not realistic. Number two it is an expectation that society pushes on us and it is absolutely toxic. Right?

Speaker 1: 9:42

A hundred percent and it's. You know it goes back to juggling balls, right? Glass balls versus bouncy balls. And you have to decide in your life what is those glass balls that if they drop and they break that's the issue versus a bouncy ball that's going to bounce right back up. And looking at that in that mindset, and then, if you've never looked at life that way, and then you have kids, you are going to start dropping balls.

Speaker 3: 10:09

Oh, absolutely.

Speaker 1: 10:10

It happens. It happens, but I really do think it is. We don't give ourselves grace right. We don't give ourselves credit for the things we do. Well, that becomes so part of our routine that you know the biggest, like I always say this. It's like you know the biggest, like I always say this. It's like you know, if a mom gets sick or a mom goes away, all the things that she does to keep that house and their family in motion, when you have to ride it out or someone else has to do it for you, that's really sometimes a good point for everybody to look back and go oh my gosh, she does it all and you do it all all day long and you do it tired, you do it sick that you don't even credit yourself for what's become routine.

Speaker 3: 10:55

Right, absolutely Well, because it's what we call micro decisions. You know, like making the kids breakfast. Okay, that's not a huge decision because my kids are seven and four, so they can tell me that they want Apple Jacks or pancakes or eggs for breakfast. They're telling me at this stage what it is that they want, but guess who has to remember to get those things from the store.

Speaker 1: 11:17

Whitney.

Speaker 3: 11:18

Yes, I have to be the one to remember it at the store, and heaven forbid, I forget the Apple Jacks, because then it's anarchy, because I wronged them, because I forgot the cereal. It doesn't matter that we have three boxes of Cheerios. That is irrelevant. Irrelevant Does not matter to the four-year-old.

Speaker 1: 11:40

The people will riot. The people will riot over the Apple Jacks. But I love your point about the micro decisions too, because I don't think we ever look at life that way. But it totally is right. It's even like your kids. What are they wearing? Do they need a jacket? Do they not? To the? Do I have everything I need To? When do I? Should I get gas? Before or after work? Should I? You know, like all those little tiny things and some of these, like you know, I always find it fascinating. Some of these large, powerful, you know, founders and businessmen, they'll like wear the same thing basically every day. And when they're asked about this, they say I make so many decisions a day, so many multitask decisions, picking out your clothes. I do not give any of my brain energy to that and I wear the same thing every day. So when I wear the same thing a couple of times a week, I say you know what I'm saving that micro decision for something else.

Speaker 3: 12:38

Yeah, and regardless of if you agree with him politically or not, Barack Obama is a really good example of that, Because when he was president, he was like I either have a Navy suit or a gray suit. Those are my choices. I have the same thing for breakfast and lunch every day. And when he said that I was like wait a second, You're on to something Earth shattering Consistency.

Speaker 1: 12:59

When that's something I have started is like what can be so routine and set up for my success that I'm not taking those thoughts, because I mean we're getting a zillion thoughts and I mean just the fact. I mean I don't know if you guys, as kids, have group me's or not for your classes, where it's like a parent communication system.

Speaker 3: 13:19

We were good at work at the hospital and I wanted to burn it down.

Speaker 1: 13:23

Well, I was going to say if you have a group me, I'm right there with you. If you're getting those communications and why, they're great. But that mental overload that I mean I am fine of eating the same turkey sandwich every day for lunch because that group me chat can take me down. They're all inscribed like I can't think. So that is truly, I think, a good way to say make your life easier. And if you are minimizing and magnifying things, go back and see how many many tasks you're doing, how many many decisions you're making and give yourself a grace. So that was a good, that's a great one. Okay, ooh, emotional reasoning you base your view of a situation on yourself or others, how you're feeling, versus reality.

Speaker 3: 14:09

Can I tell you this is such a common discussion with clients. It's so common and to give people reassurance, just because you make a decision based off of your emotions does not mean that you have something like borderline personality disorder or bipolar disorder or anything. You may not have a diagnosis, Okay.

Speaker 3: 14:30

We feel emotions strongly because that is our brain and our intuition trying to make sense of things. It is, you know, so to, I guess, throw out a real life example of mine was a few years ago our dog Haley was starting to decline. I had actually taken her in for her yearly exam and this was during COVID, so I couldn't actually go in with her. But they brought her back out to the car and they said, well, have you noticed such and such spots on her? And that they're yay, round and all this. And I was like, well, there's the one on the back of her leg, but you know, it's been there for a long time, Hasn't really grown. We've brought her in. Nobody really seems that alarmed. And they said, well, have you not noticed the other spots, like all over her rib cage and stuff? And I was like, well, no, no, I haven't. And so it was.

Speaker 3: 15:19

Basically we were left with the decision of a super invasive surgery on a 10 year old dog, or, you know, terminate, essentially not on a timeline, but that would be. You know what we got to. And when I got home and I was telling my husband about it, I was so emotional and all the things I remember two days later he goes. I think we need to do it tomorrow. And I was like tomorrow, absolutely, and I mean my emotions flew all over me because the thought of doing something so big and so permanent was very heavy. And I mean my emotions flew all over me because the thought of doing something so big and so permanent was very heavy. And I understand he was also making a decision out of his emotions too.

Speaker 3: 15:54

So it was a really difficult time, a really difficult time. Not to mention, my youngest was five or six months old, so I was still very much postpartum, very postpartum, so you have that thrown in the mix too. So I wanted to make the decision based on my emotions of no, no, no, I'm not ready to euthanize yet. No, no, no, it's not Haley's time. No, no, no.

Speaker 3: 16:18

And he was like no, like she's getting worse, she's starting to decline. So, again, we can make decisions based off of emotions, and that doesn't mean that we're bad or that we're wrong or that we have a diagnosis out there. It means that our feelings are trying to guide us. However, when we notice that we are always high emotion when making decisions, even if it's not a big decision, like euthanizing your pet, even if it's not a big decision like who are you going to marry, and things of that nature when it's smaller things and you have big emotional responses. That tells me that your parents never taught you how to regulate your emotions and how to try to sit down with your pros and cons list and have a logical approach.

Speaker 1: 17:05

Yeah, and I think too, you know, if you never learned to control your emotions, right, you may have done this in your life. And now motherhood or you're pregnant has happened, right, you have tons of hormones, you have so many life changes, you're sleep deprived, all the things, right. It is really hard to say this is a now thing versus my reality, versus you know, I think again I'm feeling depressed. This is a temporary, right. First, I am a good mother. My depressive thoughts are telling me I am not a good mother, but this is a temporary thing. I have this under control, right?

Speaker 1: 17:42

You can't say that because you don't know how to say that in that moment if you've never been taught what emotions are and regulation and what depression is, to even know depression is a condition or anxiety. What is anxiety? Because I think the whole point of this discussion we really want to say to people is like you have been maybe living this way, or this has come upon you and no one's ever helped you point out and say that is. You know that's a negative thought and this is not your reality. You will get better, or, whitney, this is a very heightened emotional time for you right now.

Speaker 1: 18:18

You know what. This is not the time to make a life or death decision. This is you know so I think it is, if we have. This has been kind of like our autopilot response, Yep I don't know how to get off Right.

Speaker 3: 18:31

Well, you know, rewind back to a few years ago when both my grandfathers died and my father in law died, all right there, within a few months of each other. I just remember telling my husband I was like we don't need to make any decisions Any time, like we don't need to trade the cars, we don't need to trade the cars, we don't need to sell the house, we need to avoid any big thing. For a while, because I knew I was in no mentality to make a decision, not a sound one, not one where I didn't have some type of a bias or like a skewed perspective.

Speaker 1: 19:03

And it's okay to say in this point of life I'm suffering from grief. I am having a huge life change. I'm pregnant. I am experiencing postpartum anxiety and depression. I had a traumatic birth. I'm still working through that. I need to put my energy into healing that part and getting better.

Speaker 1: 19:22

And you know it's not the time to move, it's not the time to talk about the career. It's working on you and that's okay. And again, just seeing it as a long-term picture versus a closed in which happens to us all, and having someone in your circle to say, really, I mean, grief is so hard for you right now, or this is so hard for you and you are trying to recover. Let's work on how to deal with these emotions and then let's make that big decision. But if a big decision has to be made, that is definitely where you want to tap in to resources and help. And don't make that alone to help you see past it, because I mean I'm probably going to say this wrong, but it's like you can't see. You know, the tree for the forest, the forest for the tree, right, like that whole view, right. That happens with emotions, especially in postpartum and pregnancy.

Speaker 3: 20:14

Absolutely. How could it not?

Speaker 1: 20:16

How could it not? That's you can't. Now the next one. I'm going to go ahead and just say we do this. Whitney Shit statements. You give yourself a list. Society gives yourself a list. You your, whatever your upbringing, where you live, what your job is, what your persona is, what you want to be as a mother. You have should. I should be doing this to be a good mother. I should be doing this to be a good wife. I should be doing this to be a good therapist. Right, were not made to do at all. And who said where are these shoulds coming from? Where's this told? Where's this like magic equation of all these shoulds equals a mother, equals a wife, equals a successful person.

Speaker 3: 20:59

Well, and I think so much.

Speaker 3: 21:00

I think millennials are kind of this really odd generation where I would say a decent portion of us I'm going to say maybe about 40% of us grew up with either a mom that was able to stay home or work part-time hours, so she was there a lot of the time.

Speaker 3: 21:21

So we really had this view of well, my mom is home, my mom doesn't have to worry about taking off work when I get sick, my mom is able to cook and clean when I go to school during the day, so then she can be there and be present with me and not be doing chores while we're all home together.

Speaker 3: 21:38

So we have that persona of it. But now, when we look at our generation, we've also been pushed to be boss babe, to climb that career ladder because we have pushed for these women's rights and I am not against that whatsoever, I am not but we have two very different perspectives and values and them trying to mesh is actually more of like a collision and it's turning into an explosion because of said collision, because we can't be the stay-at-home mom or mom that had a part-time job that we saw our mom doing and simultaneously climbing this career ladder and maintaining a household and maintaining a marriage and being able to call up work when my kid gets sick without there being repercussions or guilt. It's like we want to be able to be a mom without worrying about work and work like we're not being a mom. And it doesn't work that way.

Speaker 1: 22:44

It does not mesh and it starts, I think, very early. You know like a good girl should do this, a good or a good student does this, or a good athlete does this. Or you know you get early on your value and worth can kind of be tied to things you do and how you present yourself or what you accomplish, or what you accomplish when you really who you are should be rooted in. You know your values and if that aligns with your religion or that you know your culture, whichever way. But that is really not what society is Like. It's not what you accomplish as a person and who you are.

Speaker 1: 23:24

But it is hard when you see other people, other moms, other women, other relationships looking a certain way, not to think like you know I should be this or my child should be this. It gets really, really difficult. So I think the next time you're like, well, I should be doing that. Who said that and where does that align with your values? And again it goes back to you have to prioritize things that mean value to you and your kids and sustaining, versus what society says. And we've said this before. But social media is a lie. It's a comparison trap. It is a highlight of people's day.

Speaker 1: 24:04

When you see someone even out at the store for five minutes. That's a glimpse in their day, in their life.

Speaker 3: 24:09

That is not.

Speaker 1: 24:10

So really remind yourself. The only should statements that matter is what aligns to you and your beliefs and your values, not society.

Speaker 2: 24:18

Yeah.

Speaker 1: 24:19

Labeling and mislabeling A way to basically say you call yourself negative names.

Speaker 3: 24:24

Right.

Speaker 1: 24:25

And I think it's something that a lot of people do. Oh yeah, and they may not even be like, naturally, that you may not be like, well, I don't call myself a loser, well, no, but it may not be that. It may be not that, but maybe you miss your child's soccer game because you had a work thing, or your other kid had something, or you know something was going on and you're like, you're like I'm a bad mom. You know, are those bad? Those negative self-talk starts coming Right.

Speaker 3: 24:51

Yeah Well, and I think it's easy for us to hone in on the negative because I think we hold ourselves, and society does, to those unrealistic standards and so when we don't meet those standards or expectations, we feel like a failure. So then it's easy to internalize and absorb that and that's a huge component of anxiety. I don't know if anyone that's listening has watched Inside Out 2, but they do a good job of depicting anxiety, of how there's this fear of failure or this fear of being viewed as negative. So I'm going to go and do all these different things to try and avoid that, but then I actually create a bigger mess by overcompensating.

Speaker 1: 25:33

Yeah, and I think you have to be very careful again with self-negative talk or self-negative thoughts in the sense of I'm a failure, I'm not a good mom, can't even do that, right, or you know, because again the negative sticks right and then that common thought power will keep going. So you have to challenge that and you have to say you know what? I am a good mom, right, so you know I may have missed that soccer game. I'm going to show up to the next one. Not all parents are able to make everything. That does not define me as a good mom, right, it is okay. So you have to talk back to that.

Speaker 1: 26:07

But it is so sometimes natural to us to put ourselves down in some way of our thoughts if we didn't do it perfect, that you don't realize you shouldn't be doing it Right, absolutely. You criticize and blame yourself if things go badly in a situation that's not in your control. So take, for example I was late this morning because there was a wreck and literally things went. You know it took over an hour, when it usually takes 15 minutes, you know, to 20 minutes, and I think we do this too, especially in the postpartum phase. Right, it's like you, your baby was up all night. Yeah, I wasn't doing something right. I couldn't get the baby to sleep. It was my fault, my fault, right? I'm not a good mom. I can't like now our whole day. And it's like.

Speaker 1: 27:02

The reality is, sometimes you can do everything perfect and a baby's just not going to sleep, or they have a bad night. I mean us as adults. Sometimes I just don't sleep as well as I did the night before. No thing is there. So I think it is saying we tried our best. A lot of things are not in our control. What is in your control versus not in your control?

Speaker 3: 27:23

Yes, absolutely.

Speaker 1: 27:25

And I think, we think a lot of things are in our control. That's not.

Speaker 3: 27:29

Oh, absolutely Well. And again, as type A's, we really like to control the situation. It calms that anxiety component. So when, especially in postpartum, when we don't have control over the situation, we start to panic, that anxiety skyrockets and we start to again internalize and think what am I doing wrong? Why can't I control this? Well, you can't control traffic.

Speaker 2: 27:53

No.

Speaker 3: 27:53

You could not have foreseen a wreck and thought, oh, I need to leave my house 30 minutes early. Well, you know what? If you had left the house 30 minutes early, the wreck may not have happened yet and you're at pickup or drop offline way long before it starts.

Speaker 1: 28:07

Yeah, that's the thing is. I think control is such an illusion, right, that we tell ourselves that we have and we think we do, and loss of control is scary. And again, personalization kind of helps us go back to it. It's like you know self-sabotagers, right, they will sabotage, so they have control over the situation, even if they don't even know they're doing it right, but it's like I will determine that outcome by something I do to either end this.

Speaker 1: 28:36

So it's very similar, but we really hope that going through these thought patterns has helped you kind of say huh, maybe I do think that way and next time this happens we want you to take note of it, Make a little jot in your journal, Say okay, this is the situation, this is how I kind of responded, this is what I thought. And then when you go to your therapist or when you're talking to someone in your support, that's saying do you notice, I do this Work on it.

Speaker 1: 29:03

You don't have to stay thinking like this, and Whitney sees this day in and day out. So thinking like this and Whitney sees this day in and day out, so this is common. You're not alone in this, and people get better with it. So I think it was a great start of 2025 to cover thought patterns, because we're going to challenge them and we're going to change them as the year comes.

Speaker 3: 29:24

Absolutely.

Speaker 1: 29:25

Okay, guys, thank you. We'll be back with you guys next week. See you then.

Speaker 2: 29:33

Maternal mental health is as important as physical health. The Preview Alliance podcast was created for and by moms dealing with postpartum depression and all its variables, like anxiety, anger and even apathy. Hosted by CEO founder Sarah Parkhurst and licensed clinical social worker Whitney Gay, each episode focuses on specific issues relevant to pregnancy and postpartum. Join us and hear how other moms have overcome mental health challenges, as well as access tips and suggestions on dealing with your own challenges as moms. You can also browse our podcast library and listen to previous episodes at any time. Please know you're not alone on this journey. We're here to help.