Speaker 1: 0:10

Hi guys, welcome back to PreviewLions podcast. This is Sarah and Whitney in special episode today. So Whitney is going to be in the hot seat, and not in the sense of our hey, whitney, questions, which we do love, but it is going to be. What does a therapist do? And we're going to deep dive into Whitney and into therapy and to, like you know, I think the common thing I've always thought about my own therapist is does she really practice what she preaches? What does she do when this happens? You know, what is she thinking when I'm telling her this update of craziness that's occurring, like what is she really processing? And today is again, we're trying to normalize therapy. Talk about mental health. Therapists are real people too, and we're going to dive into it, whitney. So let's start what is a typical Whitney therapy day.

Speaker 2: 1:06

So typical therapy day is I usually have six clients. Sometimes I bump it up to seven, just kind of depends, like, especially if we have a holiday or something that I may kind of fluff up my numbers for the rest of the week to have more availability. So I typically have six, maybe seven clients a day. My niche, as everybody knows, is maternal mental health. So I do see a lot of mamas that are either pregnant, they are postpartum, and I even have some clients that I saw them during their pregnancy and were even two years postpartum. Because, honestly, pregnancy and baby is not the end. All be all to our mental health. No one is a mean from life. Life will keep lifing and so there's a lot of people that I've maintained for a few years just because that's what's been needed.

Speaker 2: 1:52

So I see people for an hour, so I usually I set my timer for about 50 minutes into the session. That way we wrap it up, we schedule their next appointment and so if I'm lucky, fingers crossed that I'm able to have a potty break in between my people, get my sip of water, kind of you know, regulate myself and jump into the next one. I do prioritize my lunch break because sister has to eat and my brain needs that break. So typically I either have lunch from 12 to one or one to two, just kind of depends on my day and how early in the day I get started. Tuesdays and Thursdays I start at 8 am, so I bump my lunch up to noon because I could not do five appointments without a break. That's a lot for my brain.

Speaker 1: 2:36

And you said you mentioned brain reset, pause. What is that? Because people are like huh, because I've always said this to Whitney, because some days we will do podcasts, and we used to do like three hours of podcasts at once and mass record, and then you'd go see Clint. I thought, whitney, my brain is so tired, how does your brain input that, or how? So what is some things you do to keep your mental sanity? Because people are unloading on you? It's true.

Speaker 2: 3:02

This is hard things.

Speaker 2: 3:05

So if you which I don't think we have any listeners that follow me on Instagram because I do have a private Instagram, because my kids and internet safety and all the things but I do have what I call my emotional support diet Dr Pepper Frequently, I do have that because that is my source of caffeine, because fun fact about me I'm allergic to coffee, so I have to get my caffeine from other sources. So if I know it's a heavier day, I start my day with my Diet Dr Pepper, or that's what I get with lunch. So that's one way is I kind of have that there? I do actually make sure that I drink water throughout the day. Number one, because we need to be hydrated. Number two, it actually grounds me if I'm meeting with a client in something that they say almost triggers me.

Speaker 1: 3:46

Okay, let's pause there. So therapists get triggered.

Speaker 2: 3:50

Oh, a thousand percent. So if y'all have been listening for a while, most of you know that we had just a lot of death kind of back to back a couple of years ago. We had three deaths in two months within my family and so I mean I just know that grief and death and all of that is just maybe a more vulnerable spot for me, especially when we look at the months from October to December. It's just going to be a harder time of year for me. And I'm well aware of that client and it was their intake session and nowhere in that intake paperwork did it mention death and grief. It just talked about, you know, wanting to cope with depression, anxiety. Fair enough, they come in and turns out that they had lost a child Like their child was an adult when they passed away and it was like a chronic illness and there were several similarities with dates from their experiences with death to my experiences with death. And I was sitting there like how am I not going to just sit here and sob? So I would actually sip on my water and use that as a tactile grounding technique during that session. And when I tell you that was probably one of my most delightful clients Like I absolutely loved meeting with that person.

Speaker 2: 5:04

But oftentimes I knew, okay, this might be triggering for me, right, but as a therapist, we actually have something in our code of ethics that talks about something called counter-transference, and that is where I project my issues onto a client, almost expecting them to be my therapist, almost like a role model. Think of it like that. And so that's again star code of ethics. It's unethical for us to do that. However, I also can't prevent being triggered by similarities. Okay, that's just like. Again, no one's immune. There's no way I could avoid that. But what I can do, it is manage my reactions. So, with that, if I could ever feel myself kind of getting teary eyed or just upset, I would just take a swig of water and just kind of do that a little bit. So that is one way I try to regulate myself in session. If need be, if I need to do that in between sessions, that's definitely something that I do.

Speaker 2: 6:04

One really good way to kind of regulate our nervous systems and kind of force ourselves to get out of fight or flight is if you kind of shake a little bit and I know that that sounds silly, but really like, think of Taylor Swift's Shake it Off, like you're literally moving your shoulders and your arms. Just kind of doing that. You're re-regulating your nervous system. You're getting some of that nervous physical energy out.

Speaker 2: 6:27

Typically, if I do have a couple of minutes in between people, I can shut the door to my office and do that. Nobody sees it, nobody knows about it, it's quiet, all of those things. I don't have to worry about disrupting the therapist next to me, that I share a wall with things like that. So those are some things that I can do. If I need to like, get out lotion or a candle or sanitizer and do the deep breathing with that. That's another way that I try to ground myself and just say that was a tough session, but it's okay, that's, it's going to be okay kind of thing, and utilize those grounding thoughts along with it.

Speaker 1: 7:01

No, I love that. And then you know, I think too, we always are wondering. So cause? You are a lifetime listening and your mind is doing gymnastics, figuring out, cause it's? People tell me this all the time. You got to listen more than you speak, right? And so you are listening and you're evaluating and you're also teaching. So what tips and tricks have you? You know, because that's a lot to process in of. You're helping people redirect thought patterns. You're helping people learn new coping skills. You're de-escalating people, right?

Speaker 1: 7:38

yes, always what has been valuable, that you have learned, that now you implement in your day-to-day with that.

Speaker 2: 7:47

That's a very good question. I think some of it is. I have really learned how to take a pause, that I don't have to have the answer immediately.

Speaker 1: 7:55

Oh, I love that. I love that, and I think people in this day and age, because everything's so fast. It's like Whitney, you asked me something. I have to reply in two seconds. It has to be the right answer and perfect.

Speaker 2: 8:05

Exactly, and therapy has taught me that I don't have all the answers. For starters, I don't have all the answers, and it's okay that I express I don't have all the answers. I'm taking a minute to think on that, or I'll tell people because I mean, honestly, there are several diagnoses that look very similar to each other. You know, we look at something like bipolar disorders, we look at borderline personality disorder and we look at complex PTSD, we look at anxious attachment styles or avoidant attachment styles. All of those can have very, very similar symptomology.

Speaker 2: 8:41

And so when I'm talking to someone, it's literally like I have a ping pong ball in my brain of, well, we checked a box over here and we checked one here, but I didn't do this over here and we did do this over here. And like it's constantly going back and forth and I will tell clients. I'll say, you know, in full transparency, I kind of have some mental gymnastics going on, like I'm thinking that we're clicking boxes for different things, but I don't want to jump the gun on something. But, admittedly, if you were going to someone for therapy, not for medications, admittedly, if you are going to someone for therapy, not for medications, not for medications and not for an evaluation of something specific, then the goal is not necessarily a diagnosis. The goal is to work through things and to equip people better and to cope better, and so I think, having that knowledge going in, you may not walk out of your first therapy appointment with a diagnosis.

Speaker 1: 9:33

That's pretty appropriate, I was going to say I would argue I wouldn't want it.

Speaker 1: 9:36

The first one you know, unless I was blatantly like you know came in and was like this all started post my birth. This, you know, and this happened during my birth and this is now. I can't sleep, I'm having panic attacks, you know. I think there would be certain ways you know, presentations that I could lay it out or be situational therapy, Right. But if you're like my whole life I've noticed I've struggled with X, y and Z or this happened with my family and that's you know. Like you have 50 minutes, that is not enough time to unpack your whole life. A lot of times it's not even enough time to unpack a situation.

Speaker 2: 10:14

Correct.

Speaker 1: 10:15

You got to introduce characters to your therapist, you got to say this is this person, this is this person, this is this situation. And two I think it is important to say your therapist will only know what you tell them. And then that sense of if you leave out a lot of parts, whitney's mental gymnastics has to go ding ding, ding, ding ding, versus you filling in the whole situation and saying, well, I did say this and do this, or I, full transparency, whitney did X, y and Z.

Speaker 2: 10:48

Right and I will say it's a little bit of a catch 22 because insurance requires a diagnosis to bill. So oftentimes I will do a diagnosis and treatment plan. More often than not, with adjustment disorders that can present with anxiety or depression or both, I can start there to satisfy insurance and then I can really dig deeper with people.

Speaker 1: 11:17

I mean, everybody has adjustment issues. Let's just say that.

Speaker 2: 11:20

Right. Adjustment disorder is a honestly, it's a very good umbrella. It satisfies a lot of things. I can build a really solid treatment plan with an adjustment disorder.

Speaker 1: 11:31

Yeah, and I think that's a huge thing.

Speaker 2: 11:33

Yeah, if someone comes to me and they've had a traumatic event and we have, you know, we're having nightmares, we're having flashbacks, we're having hypervigilance that one I usually feel pretty comfortable saying well, we have some PTSD. Honestly, most people that struggle with PTSD know that they already struggle with it. I'm not telling them something they don't know.

Speaker 1: 11:51

Yeah, what now? When you are done with your clients, you're going home. Now, whitney, well, you've never taken off the mom hat or wife hat or family hat, but let's say you're switching those Cause I think I hear from a lot of women it's very difficult to move from maybe your work face, your mom face, to this. Now you're having this conversation or this role and we're doing a lot of things at once. How do you get kind of a any things you want to share of how our listeners can be like that's a great way from like transitions. This is how a tip to transition those modes, or this is a transition to I had a bad day at work, or that was really heavy, or I I'm seeing this client, but I know my child's sick and the nurse just called. You know kind of those, right?

Speaker 2: 12:36

so one thing that did help was we actually moved over the summer and before we moved I was seven minutes from work, which was very nice. I'm not gonna lie, it was super nice to have that. Now I'm about 15 20 minutes from work, so still not a terrible commute. That has helped me actually get some music in where I'm about 15, 20 minutes from work, so still not a terrible commute. That has helped me actually get some music in where I'm not having to really use my brain.

Speaker 1: 12:57

Okay, so you, whitney, unplug.

Speaker 2: 13:00

I do. I have to unplug a little bit. If the weather is good, I will open my sunroof just because I enjoy the sun. I love the sun. It's nice to kind of get that airflow going. It's nice to just kind of decompress. Yeah, I will say I think it's been easier for me as a therapist to leave work at work versus when I worked in the hospital. Hospital was a different story because you got to, you saw a lot of things and you can't unsee things.

Speaker 1: 13:33

Yeah.

Speaker 2: 13:33

You know I will say do I hear some very heavy and traumatic stories from my clients? Absolutely I do. And there are days that I walk out of here and it's heavier than it usually is, and that's when I have to tell myself okay, if I genuinely brought my best to therapy that day, did I give my clients the best that I was able to give them? Then it's okay that I leave it at work. Yeah, it actually is okay that I do that, Because then, if I bring it home, I'm not actually giving my family what I have left.

Speaker 1: 14:06

Yeah, I think that's a huge thing and it is. I think it's so hard to not let things just all run together. Some people are fans of mom and it's like, well, everything really is like your house. You know it takes like. You just feel like you don't get changes in the environment, you don't get breaks, and that from the work-from-home that can feel the same way too. Right, if some way to check in that mind, check out that mind on certain situations or certain events. I think that's a huge thing. And Whitney's a runner. I know a lot of people know this. But you run and that is your huge outlet and that is a you know you find time and space for long runs, marathon runs.

Speaker 2: 15:01

Yeah, halves. I have yet to find the courage slash motivation to do a full, and part of that is I really don't have the time to train for a full marathon, and that's okay. I'm just not there in my life. I don't have a huge desire to do a full marathon, and that's okay. Me and Jenny have grand plans to do Dopey at Disney one day together, but I have decided that my youngest needs to be in like first or second grade, where my oldest and her can ride the bus home, kind of.

Speaker 1: 15:29

Thing.

Speaker 2: 15:30

Yeah, yeah, like I need there to be a little more independence and like they're not going to burn the house down before we get home, kind of thing.

Speaker 1: 15:38

Yeah, no, I love that.

Speaker 1: 15:39

And then what other tips and tricks can you, as a therapist, that you, I think it's really you know? Do you practice what you preach? You know? Does Whitney, when she is out and about, you know? And anxiety strikes or fight and flight happens to you, you know, do you? Is it one of those things? Cause, you know, as a nurse, I know nurses are the worst patients ever in general and we tend to not really do our preventative healthcare or these things. So, therapists, when it comes to mental health, what does that I mean? Do you guys practice what you preach?

Speaker 2: 16:14

We kind of have to if we're going to stay in this profession. So you know this story because I texted you, because I was stuck in fight or flight.

Speaker 2: 16:23

But, I had taken my kids to the park one day just me and typically I have no concerns about doing that because it's a small park, I can see my kids and there was a situation where there was a man there that had what could have been a weapon it was like a two by four essentially and he had done something threatening towards another woman there that was walking her dog.

Speaker 2: 16:46

When my brain figured out what was happening, I scooped up my youngest and I told my oldest. I was like run to the car, just go get in the car I will explain later. Just get in the car. And it was in the point like I put my four-year-old in her car seat I didn't even buckle her. I got in the driver's seat and I drove about two blocks down the road to another parking lot, got her buckled and got home and I was rattled, rattled over that whole situation, to the point where I got home and I told my husband I was like do I call the police? And he was like yes, yes, you need to call them, they need to know what's going on. Like I was so rattled that I just thought I've got to get out of here kind of thing.

Speaker 2: 17:23

And you know, after I called the police and all that, my daughter was next to me and she just kept asking me questions and I just kept saying I know you're worried, this is why we had to leave, but we're okay now. And I had to keep saying that grounding, thought over and over of we're safe, we're okay, we're not harmed.

Speaker 2: 17:43

We were actually not directly threatened, I observed it. I observed it and I hopefully prevented what could have been a bad situation kind of thing. And so even that next day I was still very much like peak fight or flight, like I was struggling. And that's when I reached out to the other therapists that I work with. I'm like, hey, how can I get myself out of fight or flight, cause your girl is struggling over here? And that's when someone said, well, you need to try and shake it out. And I was like, yes, that's what I need to do. And that physical movement helped me actually work it out of my body.

Speaker 2: 18:16

We can't as a therapist I can't actually stay in fight or flight or panic and actually serve my clients.

Speaker 1: 18:24

You have to get back to like a baseline and recharge recenter and I think that everybody needs that's the goal, right? I mean there was, I remember that there was a. This is not the same level, but so the other day I dropped my oldest off and then we have to drive over to short distance to my youngest school. Well, my youngest has his Lava, which is a little lovey kind of like you know, little stuffed animal thing. They only make one. I've tried to find multiples, they're not a thing I would highly advise that's a veteran mom tip If you are going to introduce a lovey or a lot you know, get one that they make like five of and like store them and because, yeah, buy in bulk, buy in bulk, because that unique one that you can't replace again, that's a whole thing. So he usually, when drive off, he waves to my oldest. He's like bye, bubba, love you.

Speaker 1: 19:14

I have warned and warned and warned him not to hold Lala in that hand when I say we were crossing over one of the worst intersections where I live and I see it fly, an orange flying through the air, landing in the middle of the intersection, and my everything went to a thousand like that fight or flight. Well, he lost it. I dropped him off at school. I got him kind of calmed down and I told the teacher, whatever. And so I had to drive back through said intersection okay to get home. And I was like I prayed. I was actually like God, if it is your will for me not to die and get this lava, please, you know.

Speaker 1: 20:06

And when I say Whitney, I pulled up in this intersection and I see it and I'm like, oh my gosh. So I went into a parking lot. I had to go through the bushes. The people probably thought I was homeless A. By the way, I was dressed at that moment for drop off. B. I came through the bushes and I ran as fast as I could. I grabbed the Lala, dove back through the bushes, drove off. But I was in such a fight or flight I had to take a cold shower. I was going back. I was like what is everything I know to do? And it took a cold shower. And then I am the type that I have to physically do something. So I went and I worked out and I like had to lift weights, but I could not get that out of my system. Granted, that was like you know that child. I'll probably tell him of what I did to risk my life for the rest of his life for this.

Speaker 1: 20:53

But, it's one of those things that I couldn't like go about my day and do the meetings and do the test I needed Because, like you said, just so ramped up. Yeah. Yeah, it was scary how much my nervous system, even hours after, was like.

Speaker 2: 21:09

Yeah, just jolted.

Speaker 1: 21:11

Uh-huh. You know I think that's a huge thing is people need to be equipped of how to reset the nervous system and we have some good tips on like toolbox tips. But I think that's a great episode we can do in the future. It's just a whole episode on nervous system regulation in ways, because, yeah, that was a moment, but as we finish the conversation, what is one thing that you want listeners to know about therapists?

Speaker 2: 21:38

Oh, that we have our own issues too. Again, I've said it, I think several times this episode like we're not immune from life.

Speaker 3: 21:46

Yeah.

Speaker 2: 21:47

And, you know, to my clients who have shown me grace, I appreciate it because, like I've got kids and they're going to get sick, yeah, I'm going to have to, you know, like cancel as well, just because life does that to us.

Speaker 1: 22:00

We are not perfect, we are not going to get it perfect and hopefully, if you have a therapist, they extend that same grace to you yeah, and you know, majority of the therapists that I know have therapists themselves and I think that is key and you know it's a we're appreciative. And I think that is key and you know it's a we're appreciative, and I think it's always wonderful to pull back the curtain to people who we say these are, you know, trustworthy, they're great, they're tools equipped and like just to say you look at them and say we're in this together and to really lean in and therapy's not, shouldn't be this big, scary, taboo thing.

Speaker 2: 22:36

Right, absolutely not. It's there when you need it and you don't have to do it lifelong. Yeah, that's the thing. It doesn't have to be a lifelong thing. It could be that you just needed to get through some stuff.

Speaker 1: 22:47

Yeah, I read something recently and I forget the term for it, but they were saying like earthquake or lifequake, I think it's called a lifequake, and it was essentially saying that you're either beginning, ending or in the middle of a lifequake. And it was essentially saying that you're either beginning, ending or in the middle of a lifequake. And that is like life events that could be deaths, that could be transitions, that could be becoming a mom, that could be sending a kid off to college, that just these quakes of life that will make us feel unshaky at times or need of that extra support, and that it is. You know, it's always hills and valleys, but thank you, whitney, for being on the hot seat and letting us get to know our favorite therapist even a little bit more. Yes, all right listeners, hope you enjoyed this fun, kind of just different episode.

Speaker 1: 23:33

But again, if you are looking for therapy, if you're a Preview Alliance mom, all you have to do is text us support and we will get you settled. But if you are not and you are interested, postpartum Support International has a really great find a therapist directory. Psychology Today is amazing. You can search by your state, your insurance, maternal, mental health or PTSD, ocd, things that maybe you're struggling with. Just start there, and we always encourage you to know that the first step of seeking help is often the hardest, and after that it's all downhill from there. So thank you, guys, and we'll be back next week Sounds good Bye guys.

Speaker 3: 24:15

Maternal mental health is as important as physical health. The previous alliance podcast was created for and by moms dealing with postpartum depression and all its variables, like anxiety, anger and even apathy. Hosted by ceo founder sarah parkhurst and licensed clinical social worker whitney gay, each episode focus on specific issues relevant to pregnancy and postpartum. Join us and hear how other moms have overcome mental health challenges, as well as access tips and suggestions on dealing with your own challenges as moms. You can also browse our podcast library and listen to previous episodes at any time. Please know you're not alone on this journey. We're here to help.