Intro And Why We React

SPEAKER_02 0:09

Hi guys, welcome back to Preview Lions Podcast. This is Sarah, and I've got our favorite maternal mental health therapist, Whitney. Hi, Whitney. Hey friends. And Whitney, we've come from our real life experiences, come from our what we are experiencing. And when we were prepping for this one, a good topic that came up is no response is a response, or you don't have to attend every argument you're invited to, whichever way you want to say it. But I think we live in such a reactionary world that we feel like anything deserves a response, or that you want to get the last word. You want to get the last word. You maybe feel like, okay, well, I was growing up and I could never voice my opinion, and now I'm an adult and I can. Right. Or now I'm a mom and I'm gonna say what's best for you know, whatever. You feel this weird, plus again, truly social media, we say all the time, but you got so many keyboard warriors who you're seeing respond to everything that has nothing to do with them.

SPEAKER_00 1:17

Right. There's also, I think, an element of like instant gratification or like a dopamine hit on that because it's like, oh, I got in the last order, oh, I was quippy on that. And we see that in TV, we see that in movies, like we see people being able to get in that last little punch or to get the one up, or to say that they were able to shut him out and all of that. And I get it, there is satisfaction in that. I'm not saying that there's not because there is, and sometimes you do want to validate that you either have a correct point of view or you're defending yourself.

SPEAKER_01 1:53

I get it.

SPEAKER_00 1:54

There are times where we do need to defend ourselves and explain the situation and explain our intent or our motivation when it comes to that stuff, but sometimes no response is a response.

When Silence Is The Answer

SPEAKER_01 2:08

Yes.

SPEAKER_00 2:08

So, you know, that being said, you know, maybe you're choosing to raise your kids in a certain way, and you've got Aunt Brenda entering the chat, you know, uninvited, and she's like, Well, I really wish that you would do X, Y, and Z with your kids, or it's really a shame you're not doing this, or it's awful that you're doing this. And you know what? As much as you want to type out that novel, sometimes it is better to leave people on red and just not respond because some people are attention seeking. Okay. Yep. Some people really do love that attention, they don't care if it's negative or not, they want that attention too. Some people love drama. As we've learned with narcissists and sometimes people with borderline personality disorder, they really do love drama. They love for things to kind of get kicked up, things like that. And so remind yourself too that no response is a response, that not everything is worth your time and your energy and your capacities. That being said, sometimes we do need to get that novel out. Yes, sometimes we need to vent. And that might be you voice journal it. It could be that you pen and paper write it out, or that you write it in the notes app on your phone and then you delete it, or that you text a friend and say, Hey, I just really need to vent. Are you in a space where I can vent to you about this? Not going to them to gossip, not going to them for them to fix it for you, but just saying, I just I need to get this out and I need a safe space to do it. Can you be that person for me?

SPEAKER_02 3:41

Yeah. And I, you know, I think too, the goal is not winning, right? Like, because

Vent Without Starting A War

SPEAKER_02 3:47

if you get back, you look at a situation and you're like, I'm going to get this person, I'm going to respond back and I'm going to really zenate Brenda. Right. The goal is honestly protecting your own nervous system. Right. And protecting like your because you're going to feel yucky at some point. Like, yes, it's going to be like, yes, I told her, yes, I told them. I put them in the place. Right. But at the core of who we are, that's not going to set right. And that's not going to ultimately be the end. And then it's just going to be, and you you give them an ugly to talk about what you said too, right?

SPEAKER_00 4:21

Exactly. We don't want to give people ammunition if we can at all help it. And it kind of goes back to that example that they use with kids so often of you squirt toothpaste onto the plate, and the toothpaste are your words. And as much as you might say you're sorry, and you try to take them back, I can't put that toothpaste back in the tube.

SPEAKER_02 4:41

No.

SPEAKER_00 4:41

I can't, I physically cannot do it. And so, you know, we do need to be aware that our words do have impacts and that we need to be careful of what we say when we say it. Is it worth saying? You know, we talk about this all the time that the frontal cortex is not fully developed until we're like 26 or 27. And that goes in line with critical thinking and kind of the ripple effect of our words. Yes, we can throw the rock in the water now, and that is the response. But what's going to be that second, third, fourth ripple effect that you might be dealing with six months down the road that you're like, why on earth did I say that? So, what you want to ask yourself before you respond or if you respond is what could be the ripple effect?

SPEAKER_02 5:30

Yeah.

SPEAKER_00 5:30

What is the ripple effect of all of this? Is this going to negatively impact me down the road? Because you are allowed to consider yourself. Considering yourself is not selfish. Okay. Because we are genuinely trying to take stock of am I going to have the capacities for this six months down the road? Am I going to have the capacity for this if this is just throwing gas on the fire and it all just explodes when this is done?

SPEAKER_02 5:56

Yeah.

Pause Skills For Big Triggers

SPEAKER_02 5:57

And you know, when I was researching some of this topic, one of the number one um emotional regulations that it's like the help, like that they, if you say if someone's emotionally regulated, their emotional capacity, it is self-control and it's their ability to intentionally choose not to react impulsively.

SPEAKER_01 6:19

Right.

SPEAKER_02 6:20

And I think of our children, our toddlers, you know, no inhibition is, you know, it's just, you know, right? And we're not toddlers, but we our toddlers will bring it out of us if that's not healed. If we have never done that, you try to tell your toddler to walk through a tantrum, it's a good learning aspect for you too, to be like when that mother-in-law sends a text that really triggers you at the worst time. When the nosy neighbor says something, when your boss, or you've just worked your butt off on something, crimes and criticizes, whatever it might be, your spouse in the moment. You you have to say, okay, pause, right, take a second, go back to all the things Whitney's taught us, the counting. You know, if you're like, I need to take a sip of cold water, right? I need to put this on my uh pulse point right here. I need to take a second, I need to walk, I need to put my phone down. I'm gonna go outside, touch grass, quite literally, go sit in the grass, quite literally, and take a minute because I think with anything, time and space can take that initial front cortex just taking over away. And then again, a different perspective of like, am I reading this right? Right, and what's hard, I think the text is like you have that space, right? You're not right now. What do they say to your face, right? That's hard, is that's you're right in front of that person, you know their intention, you know the atmosphere they're doing this to you in. Right. Right. That's a little bit harder than seeing the text, and you have that barrier.

SPEAKER_00 8:05

Right. Well, and you have to ask yourself like, is this an ongoing situation, or is it like an urgent situation and everybody's cortisol is going, everybody's fight or flight is going, tensions are a little bit higher, things like that. We need to be aware or mindful of is someone else in a heightened state? Am I in a heightened state? You know, are we in an urgent care or are we at the emergency room and everybody is just concerned? And ultimately, we all have the same concern in the hopes that someone is going to be okay or better, but yet it's coming across as, well, why don't you do more? And it's like, what more could I do? And in those situations, you are better off not responding because no response is a response.

Get Curious Before You Reply

SPEAKER_00 8:50

Because guess what? When things start to kind of come down, when the situation deflates a little bit, they may go back and say, Well, I know that she read it, but like she didn't say anything. Why didn't she say anything? And they can get curious, yeah, yeah.

SPEAKER_02 9:08

And I think it to get curious is even for us, right? If somebody says something and we are offended by that, or we feel our we need to overexplain an answer, or we need to immediately come back and prove our point. Why? Why is that person? Is it a constant theme with this person? Is this a is this a touchy subject to me? Am I overwhelmed? Is it too much going on right now that this is just like kind of my tipping point? Right. Like what, why? So curiosity is great for both parties. Now, if you're emotionally aware, like we're trying to be in this life, we will probably be more curious than the narcissist. But I think too, asking anything when I say this to my boys before they say something, which I need to take, I need to myself. Is it true? Is it helpful? Is it necessary? Right, will this really matter in a week or a year?

SPEAKER_00 10:00

Like, is this necessary to add to someone's life?

When You Need To Defend Yourself

SPEAKER_00 10:05

Exactly. So, and that being said, too, if so, like if I come to you, Sarah, and I say, Sarah, why on earth did you go and steal from Aunt Brenda? Yeah, but you didn't. You didn't. What I saw was you went to Aunt Brenda's purse and grabbed a 20. What I don't know is that Aunt Brenda asked you to do that. So for you, no response almost looks like taking the blame. And so that's when you can say, Hold on, Whitney, you don't know the whole story. Aunt Brenda asked me to do this. You can go ask her yourself. So in that, you're defending your good character, you're defending the truth because there's an accusation brought to you. And you need to clear your name, and you should.

SPEAKER_02 10:51

Yeah.

SPEAKER_00 10:52

Now, if it's one of those people just seem to be all up in arms and they think, oh, you should do it this way or you should do it that way, and blah, blah, blah. You've got 20 different opinions coming at you. And here's the thing: you're the mom. You know your child better than anybody else. So you're doing what is right for your child because you know them. Guess what? Don't don't honor that person by giving them a response, not in the moment, anyway. Now, a few hours later, when things have calmed down and you're like, okay, I think I can actually respond in a less harsh way, by all means. That's perfectly fine, or you can leave them on red. Because leaving on red is not the same as ghosting.

SPEAKER_02 11:35

Well, you're not avoiding, you're not running, you're not being avoidant, you're not saying I'm avoiding, you're just choosing in that moment. Right. Hey, I they don't deserve that response from me because it is a lot of cat and mouse, especially if we're talking about narcissists or power control people, or they're wanting to bait you. Or again, there is people that like we said, if you're being talked about, you're relevant to them, right? Like they just want to be relevant to you, or they just want to know that they are occupying a part of your conversation. We see that a lot of mother-in-laws and couples will do something, subconsciously or not, and that causes a conflict between you and your husband. Mm-hmm.

SPEAKER_00 12:17

Because they feel the need to insert themselves. And that's not what they need to do.

SPEAKER_02 12:24

No. And I

Parenting Opinions And Leaving On Read

SPEAKER_02 12:25

think it's like, you know, never not everything needs a response. And that's that's the key. It is hard though, and it's very difficult when it involves our children. And innately, there is something inside of us that's like, no, we are a good mom, and it can feel attacking if someone comes against what we're doing with our child, if it's especially involving safety or a choice. That can just bring out the mama bear where you are just like ready to rip someone apart.

SPEAKER_00 12:51

Right. Well, and again, you know, if we take it back to like your kid is sick or they're hurt and you go to urgent care or you go to the emergency room or something like that, you're heightened as you should be. We would expect that. That's an appropriate response for you to be hyper-vigilant in that moment because you're hyper-vigilant for your child. You're also, you know, probably information overload because you've got doctors and nurses saying, well, let's do this, or let's do that, or maybe we need surgery, or maybe we need a medication, or whatever the case is. You've got a lot going on. Okay. And I've used this analogy before, it's like a pull and peel twistler. You're getting pulled in a lot of directions at that same time. There's not enough of you to go around. And so when Aunt Brenda or mother-in-law or your mom or your spouse or whomever decides to insert themselves in that and say, Well, I really think that you should do this, or I think that you should do blah, blah, blah. In that moment, take a deep breath and say, Is this a helpful thing for me to incorporate? So, you know, if it is, you know, your spouse saying, Hey, you know, remember when they fell the other day? Do you think that their stomach pain could be associated with that? That would be a valid question to ask your doctor about. Absolutely. Because guess what? Maybe you were out at the grocery store and that happened and you didn't know about it because it just didn't seem like that big of a deal at the time. Well, now we can bring it up and say, hey, my husband told me about this. Could that be playing a role in it? Whereas your spouse could say, Well, make sure that you do this and this and this, and I'm disappointed in you because you let this happen, and now we're gonna have to have an emergency room copay. Like it's coming at an aggressive way, not a care and concern of hey, ask about this. That way we can rule something in or rule it out.

SPEAKER_02 14:40

Yeah.

unknown 14:40

No.

SPEAKER_00 14:41

And in those situations, you're better off not responding. And I will say, not responding or no response is a response is not the same as ghosting because you're not cutting off communication forever.

SPEAKER_02 14:54

No, it's a pause of that, yeah. And on the separate note, too, is you know, don't hear this episode and text your best friend about something totally different, and they don't respond and go, Oh my gosh, they're no response. They hate me. No, no, she probably read it as she was doing something, and now she's on with her kids, and then it'll hit her the next couple days, but oh my god, I did I respond. Did I mentally I mean I read it and thought I responded, but I didn't. I've mentally responded multiple times to people, and I'm like, oh my gosh. And it is the worst when you look back and you like need to text them, you're like, I never actually put that.

SPEAKER_00 15:30

Oh my god, I thought I responded, or you type a response and didn't hit send.

SPEAKER_02 15:35

It's happened. So don't think that with everything.

Make Them Repeat What They Said

SPEAKER_02 15:38

And one of the face-to-face, if I I've learned this, I've read some good interesting books of kind of on this topic, especially with narcissists, or if you got just really triangulation going on and the families is this was say, I Whitney insulted me, and she was like, Oh, Sarah, is that really what you're wearing today? And the key is pause, don't respond in that moment, just take a minute, put some enough of awkward silence where Whitney does not get that immediate reaction. And I can go, I'm sorry, can you say that again? Yeah, make them repeat themselves. Make them repeat. Especially that works great if it's in a larger setting, because then if they did it, if they did intentionally try to or to embarrass you, right, and get that in. If they have to repeat that, that's an unkind thing they're saying to you in front of other people, that's really not a good look.

SPEAKER_00 16:44

Right. Or then you'll kind of hear them say, Oh, well, I didn't mean it in that way. I just thought, oh, what a wonderful dress you chose to wear tonight.

SPEAKER_02 16:52

So give that space, ask them to repeat what they said. Right. And then, how was that intended to hurt me? Right. Ask.

SPEAKER_00 17:02

Clarify.

SPEAKER_02 17:03

I clarify the couple of little helpful tense that if you do feel like, okay, Whitney, Sarah, I get it, I'm gonna respond. Maybe try one of those versus that initial attack we all want to do. Right, because we're human, we're human, but let's let's do it in a more composed way where we can get curious about it and not add any extra villain that they're trying to paint us to. Don't give them any extra to say, well, actually it's don't give me a few. No, do you see how Whitney responded there? Don't give her that. But just know that this is something that we're all still in trying to figure out. And no matter what life area you're in, we're all trying to figure out how to respond to some people.

SPEAKER_00 17:49

Absolutely. Well, and here's the thing: even as a therapist, like I'm not immune from it because guess what? I live in a world with people, and I am a person, I might be that person that you need to be like, oh, I'm gonna give that some space because I know she didn't mean it like that.

SPEAKER_02 18:05

No, we just need to make sure Whitney runs and she's fine. That's that's it. That's it. If I'm running, I'm happy. She's running, she's happy. All right,

Wrap-Up And Topic Requests

SPEAKER_02 18:14

friends. We will be back next week with another episode. But thank you for being with us. And if there's any topics, send us a message and we'll we'll hit it. Till next time.

SPEAKER_00 18:23

See ya.

SPEAKER_02 18:26

Maternal mental health is as important as physical health. The Preview Alliance podcast was created for and by moms dealing with postpartum depression and all its variables like anxiety, anger, and even apathy. Hosted by CEO, founder Sarah Parkers, and licensed clinical social worker Whitney Gay, each episode focuses on specific issues relevant to pregnancy and postpartum. Join us and hear how other moms have overcome mental health challenges as well as access tips and suggestions on dealing with your own challenges as moms. You can also browse our podcast library and listen to previous episodes at any time. Please know you're not alone on this journey. We're here to help.